Randy, my setup likes a really loose hold..virtually free recoil that's only limited by the 'lil end of the scope banging away on my glasses.

   I also use the Hoehn 1/2 risers and like them quite a bit. If I spend enough time getting set up so that I can sit with my back as straight as possible and get behind the gun as straight as I can, I can shoot it completely free recoil with well over 1" of clearance between the butt and my shoulder. With less than 1" of clearance, my combo usually works better with light shoulder contact. I think the gun comes back enough with less than 1" clearance to mess with the follow through, even though my own follow through seems okay...hope I'm explaining this in a not-too-Forbidden Zone way. HeeHeeHee!     -Al

   P.S. There is a lot HOW you get around a target with each particular setup. Certain combos of stock/rest height/bags/fore end profiles (side and bottom)/ length of pull, etc, etc, are very forgiving..and some are NOT. Some of the touchy ones will let you sit there and pound little groups all day long, but once you start moving around the target all is not skittles and beer.

    This can be somewhat covered up at 100 yds, but it can get pretty ugly at 200 and make you start doubting you gun and/your flag reading.

   Again, some combos seem to work with whatever you do, and some are very touchy. Stan and Todd have been the Guinea Pigs in our bunch on this lately and the results have been kind of interesting.

   Nice to see all the people checking in on Stan and Ryan's forum...    -Al